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Tutorial, assorting players and other things

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Hi, hello, greetings (from Poland)!
On start sorry for my English, I do my best.

This is my first post on the forum, since I think I shouldn't say anything, if i have nothing constructive to say. After about two hundreds of matches, completing my own team and nailing all three roles I've got some thoughs and feedback to tell you - by you I mean our dear development team and the community - as we can discuss some prepositions below.

Let's get started.

TRAINING or "give me a break, I want to check something out!"

The tut' really helps to get into the game, indeed. I pulled into HMM a couple of my friends and it helped them quite good with getting familiar with game basic mechanics. I really think that making the tutorial obligatory for new players in some last patch was a good move, as it prevents getting new players laming around in first matches spoiling fun to little bit more experienced players.
So, what is wrong about it? Maybe nothing really. But I really miss some  training mode. I'll start from the later one.
I know, you are messing around with the bomb mechanics in few weeks to make it more intuitive, but still. For example to me it's quite frustrating to try new moves and techniques while public match. I don't want to make my team (even if it's totally random) lose because of my freaking out. "Why did you do this?!" "Sorry guys, I wanted to try something else, but I screwed up, not intentionally". It's embarassing situation. The second aspect of that is that I pulled in my wife and she still need some practice, especially in moving around or catching the bomb.
I wanted to learn, how to throw the bomb more powerfully, since in combat situations it was hard to get know, how to. So I fired up the tutorial again, crawled through first steps about driving and attacking and just then I've got the bomb on empty map to mess around with it. Quite boring way to train moves in peace.

So the training mode would let player to go on an arena, maybe specifically designed for training, and try some moves, attacks and so in peace, without interference of other players. With option to spawn some chosen bot pilots on demand, to try attacking in some way.
Training would also let you to try builds on your favourite machine. I've had enough time to decently experiment and compare builds in extremely long matches (so far the record was 55 minutes and in early feedback for your upcoming combat test - that long match was tiring and stressing, but damnsatisfying. Even if we would lose it). The training with infinite metal would be good place to spawn choosen bot pilot and try to slay or counter it.

CROWD CONTROL PROBLEM (a.k.a Clunker syndrome)

I think that the way the CC is counted is kinda unclear and makes match results frustrating.
For example, I formed my own team (Chaos Works, if you see anybody in Europe region with [CW] tag, then you met one of us ;) ). We usually play in combination Black Lotus / Photon / Wildfire / Clunker. We win a match and get awesome stats. Time to take a look at the summary. My wife (Wildfire) gets top damage, Shiru gets top repair (Photon), Cfox gets top bomb posession (Black Lotus) aaaand... I don't get top crowd control. Moreover, I don't get ANY crowd control. It's kinda sad, that . I really don't understand, why towing, pulling by ulti, causing bomb drops on droppers isn't counted as crowd control. These are the main strategies for Clunker, as the brothers don't deal an outstanding damage and are stated as max crowd control on stats bars in pilot selection menu. Does Artificer's ultimate count as crowd control? Or catching more than two opponents on Rampage's dozer dash? If yes, then I think that behind CC counter stands some really unconsistent logic.
And to be clear - I don't write it because I want to make a game easier while playing my favourite pilot. I play lot of other characters, I was described by friends as a "Wildfire expert". Clunker's mechanics are most fun to me and I chosen this pilot because I "dropped" Wildfire to wife. But it's still disappointing, when suddenly I can't get any top result and don't know, what am I doing wrong.

CASUAL MATCHES PLAYER SELECTION, or maybe problem with EXP system?...

The main problem with it is just level system of the game. Not really the level system itself, because it's quite equitable (in kinda socialistic way, haha. The way you get EXP isn't objectively fair, but makes less sucessful players (or these who's got worse day) feel good and not frustrated, that they would get less experience for worse performance in match. It's really good and makes the game more attractive for new players, and gives active players a chance to get fame fast (but still not too fast).

The problem starts, when you want to play a game with some random players. The way players are selected by the server isn't stated anywhere and all I will write will be based on my presupposition. I guess, that the game gather 8 players basing on their experience points (or, in direct logic, basing on their profile levels). It isn't good, because you can reach 30th level playing like a total moron, especially if you have some luck and are the only moron in your team. You play bad, but the whole team happens to win the match and you get experience points for, something like, free, because you didn't put very much effort to play well. Moreover, your lame playstyle resulted in longer and more exhausting battle for your team and you get even more EXP for match duration.

So, is it really a problem? It may be good system for just leveling and getting fame for even levels. But doesn't represent your real experience and more importantly - your skills. I affects matches with random players.
It may be unbelievable, but a few days ago we played a two-player party/group (level 26 and 18) + random matches with two random teammates and we hit upon two guys who completely didn't know how to play. Literally, and to depict the course of occurences: they chosen Rampage and Monster (we played Clunker and Wildfire), Rampage gone to first grid, Monster didn't even try to transport the bomb. Both didn't upgrade any skills during whole 45-minute match (we could make a walkover, but our team pride didn't let us). That was terrible game, literally 2vs4.

Other thing - we gathered four of our team and hit some randoms. We played one hour and 20 minutes. The first 20 minutes was quite hard match against some really good players (I don't remember the team tag, but I greet player with d e a t h nickname on this moment!). The later hour we spent winning 30 matches in a row against unorganized, weak players and as our transporter, Cfox, said - these 30 wins were less satisfying than losing to that first team

How to solve that problem? Mathematically it may be some challenge for game designers and programmers. However I'm sure it isn't impossible, while you have already implemented tons of statistics for player's profiles. However I'd suggest, that under the hood of the game there should be hidden (not visible for players, but important for automatic selection of players for a casual match) some stats based on parsed statistics of player, for example:
- Successiveness. Player's results with some pilots, for example, average DPM per match while playing Wildfire, CC while playing Clunker, Repair done to allies as Photon, number of dropped bombs for Lotus and so. These aspects counted would indicate player's practical, real skills closed in one, single number.
- Role Successiveness - average of Sucessiveness factor per all matches played in certain role.
- Flexibility. Something like parsing number of matches won/lost playing as INT/TRAN/SUP, multiplied by Role Successiveness factor.

I think that these attributes may be more accurate in assorting players for match. 


I guess that there are more things I thought about these 100 hours spent in the game, however I don't remember them now.

I encourage you to discuss these aspects and ideas. Let's make HMM even more enjoyable! ;)

Edited by Hiden

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Well, I was thinking about parsing/assorting players and the EXP system.
I've read somewhere (on website? In game? I don't remember), that new skins for your pilot are the good way to show other players, that you're experienced with that pilot or in the whole gameplay...
How do we get new skins? First, you have to buy the pilot (btw, my wife was scraping together fame for Stingray just to find out, that it's really not her favourite pilot. It would be avoidable by possibility of driving specific pilot in suggested training mode). When you have that pilot already, you have to level him/her up to certain level (level to level, lol-grammar) to unlock the skin.

So to unlock the skin you have to collect EXP points. Let's get back to the essence sentence - skins are visual expression of your experience and skill. Beware, noobz! Here comes Wildfire with Metal Legend skin! It's gonna be slaughter.... except not really.
Why? Because as I stated in the main post of the topic, you can play like a moron and nonetheless you get EXP, so sooner or later you will hit the max level. And it will not mean, you can play well.

For now, when the game is really young and there are lot of new players, that dissonance isn't so frequent, because lot of them didn't manage to get certain levels yet. But after the time, when the community will grow bigger and older, lot of players will hit the level and buy skins. It will cause "skin inflation" and make skins as unimportant in particular player's image perception, as in LOL or other MOBAs. As our support (experienced at other MOBAs) said recently "you know, if somebody buys an expensive skin, we have 75% chance to find out, that he is just lame player who want to show off".
It doesn't apply to all players. It wouldn't be problem in such case. The problem is, that some players severely earn their EXP points and Fame, put efford in their playstyle and so, then buy their skins and proudly present themselves as really skilled players - and it really works. However, players, who don't do the job well, may do the same thing. It deppreciates skins value and makes the whole phenomenon useless.

So back to the topic - the EXP system has problems though. It causes bad estimation of players' skills while assorting them to new casual match and let weak players get profits just for work of their skilled teammates. It isn't fair. Why should I put efford to the match? Let others do the work, I will collect EXP points in the end anyway.
There were lot of matches when I've had a flash of thought like "he isn't doing anything useful in our team. We will rip our veins to win that match, and he will get exp and fame as much as we get". It made me angry not once, not twice.

Please rethink that aspect of the game. I think, it should be a little bit more (un?)balanced.

Edited by Hiden

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Hi Hiden!

I agree with what you wrote about Training Mode. I also asked to make one Training Mode very similar with what you explain above but they only said to me :" This is not the focus now to us". I hope they can make it as soon as can. 

The Crowd Control works very wierd. Some weapons do it (like second Artificer's Weapon) but like you mentioned Clunker's Weapon don't do it even if his function is almost Crowd Control in the game ( more Crowd Control than damage per minute) . I think in this next update they can change how work and what can be usefull to show in the stats ( For example: Photon always win Heal per min if we compare with others Sup Cars, but that don't show us how effective the heal really are).

And finally, about Casual Matches. I think the best way to fix it is start Ranked Matches and come back to separate Casual Matches with Bot Matches. What you propose to put Successiveness etc can be used in Ranked Matches. If I am new player, the best way to practice and learn (after Tutorial) is Training Mode. After learn it , you can probably test it with Bot Matches, only after it you can test it with players in the Casual.

What do you think about it?


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Hello Hiden!

First of all, thank you for your post. Your English is very good, I was able to understand you perfectly haha.

This kind of feedback is important for us to continue improving our game. Now, I'll address your opinions and points made.

As we have announced, we're going through a test period in the next few weeks. Changes will be made, but the points you specifically addressed are now on hold. We would love for you to play and test everything you want there. After this, you'll be able to fill a form with what you enjoyed most, and you feel it's lacking in the game. Things like Practice mode you pointed, Crowd Control mechanics and statistics, you will be able to express your feelings more thoroughly there as well. 

But your post here is very good, so every community member who's a part of the forums are able and we want them to give their opinion on this and other subjects since we gather these ideas, as well as their reception.


Keep it up and hope to keep seeing on the forums!



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Hi Sefirofe!
I'm glad that my post may be helpful and I hope it will make at least just a little difference in terms of any future changes :)
As a former / suspended game-developer I have much more observations, notices and ideas for your game. The most significant will be preposition with fully designed new pilot (I hope you know already about that, as I asked your social media guy for some pics of vehicles meshes ;) )

I'd really like to help you to make the game more attractive, since even at this moment it is very, very enjoyable and have GREAT potential, also for e-sports. I'd like to share my experience (probably smaller, but yet maybe different) and some knowledge with you - "two heads are better than one" ;)
HMM absorbed me the most of all games i played in last 8 years. In past I chiped in lot of modding communities and I just can't resist the temptation to add my twomenn'orth to that title. Not only as community member, but also as a designer ;)

I'll just wait for new changes and surely will give you some feedback! :)

Edited by Hiden

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